[CAS14]

According to the manufacturer, "By displacing moisture in the wood, PENTACRYL does help to speed the drying process by up to 30%."

So, my two sticks have soaked (no vacuum applied) for a week. They each are a tad over 2" in diameter. The oak was cut completely green. The locust was cut sometime last summer or fall along a power line right of way, and I found it a few weeks ago.

So, if these will dry sufficiently to safely work on in (up to) 30% less time, how long do you think I should wait? Keep in mind, I'm 66 and can't wait forever! ;-)

 

[Shawn C]

According to the math, about 6 months...?

 

[CAS14]

According to the math, about 6 months...?

That's what I was guessing, but hoping I was wrong. Somewhere I read something about a moisture measurement, but I don't need devices that I'll use only a dozen times and intuitively, such a measurement seems likely to be error prone.

 

[NightKnight]

Something like this?
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/AMPROBE-Moisture-Meter-6NZH4?cm_sp=IO-_-IDP-_-RR_VTV70300505&cm_vc=IDPRRZ1

 

[CAS14]

Something like this?
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/AMPROBE-Moisture-Meter-6NZH4?cm_sp=IO-_-IDP-_-RR_VTV70300505&cm_vc=IDPRRZ1

Yes, I may have read one of your posts on the slingshot forum, I don't recall. That manufacturer claims a +/- 2% error in the range of 8-60% moisture content. There are interesting comments on the top Google search link: http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Moisture_Meter_Accuracy.html

This study by a forester at SUNY concludes that they are effective and illustrates some experimental data: http://www.esf.edu/nekda/documents/MoistureMeters-BillSmith-NEKDASpring09.pdf

Regarding the pin type, do you think these pins will penetrate a moderately dried hardwood to 1/4 to 1/5 the total thickness, as the study states is necessary to obtain a valid average moisture content for the piece?

 

[NightKnight]

I would think that they would be able to, as they look pretty thin. But, it might be one of those buy then try scenarios.

 

[CAS14]

Question while I am waiting six months to continue working on the two that I have soaked in Pentacryl all week:

If this stuff really works as advertised, is it possible to remove a lot of the wood that will ultimately be removed anyway up front. Then I won't be wasting Pentacryl on wood that will be removed later, the drying time may be less, and the Pentacryl may better penetrate the entire thickness.

If this logic is flawed, someone here with experience will know first hand. I have an oak stick in the garage, still green, ready to be whittled or soaked.

 

[Shawn C]

Probably, but I would still keep several inches on either end, and continue to soak it awhile. The stuff takes a while to air dry as well.

 

[JJireh]

I came across this article a few days ago, I am planning on trying some carving on a fresh cut sappling next week and seeing how it goes. If true, this is a more cost effective way of helping green wood cure without checks and cracks and possibly conditioning it while still allowing for use of any finishes later.

Scroll down halfway to "Green wood" and read on:

http://www.ronkent.com/techniques.php

 

[Shawn C]

JJireh, could you tell me what species you have cut and are planning to carve? Some hardwood species are a must to carve green, such as maple and cherry. With maple, it is my experience that there is not much danger in splitting when carving a fresh cut sapling no more than 2 inches thick - I have carved thousands of them. A cherry sapling, on the other hand, must also be carved green (much too hard when dry), but must be treated quickly, as it does tend to split and check terribly. For this reason, I mostly avoid cherry when carving green sticks.

So what is it you are planning to carve? Some species are not really good carving at all, if you are referring to traditional carving with conventional carving tools.

 

[JJireh]

Sure Shawn, I use Oak, wild black cherry, ash, maple, apple, osage, dogwood, and hackberry. I have pretty much always carved them all dried, some required a little more stropping than normal, but no real issues. The one i have now is a nice oak twistie that my 2nd born daughter found this past weekend and wants carved.

 

[CAS14]

I came across this article a few days ago, I am planning on trying some carving on a fresh cut sappling next week and seeing how it goes. If true, this is a more cost effective way of helping green wood cure without checks and cracks and possibly conditioning it while still allowing for use of any finishes later.

Scroll down halfway to "Green wood" and read on:

http://www.ronkent.com/techniques.php

Holy deficit reduction, Batman! This would simplify my life, speed things up, and avoid the Pentacryl odor in my garage if the COSTCO house brand (Kirkland) liquid dishwashing detergent mixed with an equal amount of water, works as well for me as is reported in your link.

I like the osmotic gradient theory, regarding how this works. But I REALLY like the idea of something far less expensive than Pentacryl, and something that works more quickly, since I never know whether I'm going to wake up on the right side of the grass.

I plan to try this on my next stick, or rather the first stick after I can visit a COSTCO (none are in Oklahoma at this time). I hope that others do as well, to provide some data one way or the other regarding the effectiveness of this comparatively inexpensive dishwashing liquid.

I am so glad that I jumped to that link. I sure hope that this works.

Thank you,

Vance

 

[CAS14]

And so, was the COSTCO choice based on price alone? Might Ajax work as well for those without COSTCO access?

http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/video?autoStart=true&topVideoCatNo=default&clipId=5770161

 

[CAS14]

Another good read:
http://www.cnew.org/library/articles/article_avoiding_splitting/avoiding_green_wood_splitting.htm

And from Woodcraft:
http://www.woodcraft.com/Articles/Articles.aspx?articleid=313

 

[NightKnight]

"Upon reading the article in the AAW Journal, I set out to test the idea. We integrated the process into out turning classes here at Conover Workshops and tried the process on American beech, maple and cherry. While the latter two woods have a favorable radial to tangential shrinkage ratios, beech has one of the worst in North America, so we had a good test control subject. We have now tried the process on enough faceplate turned bowls to say that there is no change in the ultimate warping of the wood. What is gained by the process, however, is quicker drying with less checking and far less tear out in end grain by the tools. On dry wood, sanding is marvelous with no clogging and faster sanding through the grades. There is some debate on the Internet as to changes in color of the wood by the process. So far we have found no change in color or how the wood accepts its final finish."

Very interesting. So, its not perfect, but it can help. I wonder if this process would be aided by vacuum infusion as well.

 

[JJireh]

I wouldn't be surprised if vacuum infusion did help. It isn't perfect but understanding that they are working with 1 inch and less thin edges, warping is going to be almost inevitable. With solid wood the effects should be nominal.
Vance, I read somewhere else that any liquid dish detergent will work, but to avoid the ones with bleach (not sure why)

I haven't had a chance this week to do anything, going to try tomorrow to get started.

 

[Markus]

I have had success with leaving pieces in the back seat of my truck for a couple weeks during the summer. I try to always cut in the winter and leave them in my garage for 5 or 6 months first. It gets pretty hot here and sometimes you might come out in the afternoon and see your vehicle all fogged up. I have had a few splits but on the whole have done pretty well.

 

[Travis]

I realise this is an old thread but here's my 2 cents. My dad built rifle stocks out of walnut the last 25-30 years of his life. He made a kiln from an old gym locker about 12 inches wide, 18 inches deep, and 6 foot tall that he hung a heat lamp in. Most of the wood in it was planks anywhere from 3-6 inches thick, 4-8 inches wide, 2 1/2-4 foot long. All of it had the ends dipped in wax. Dad had gotten to know some timber buyers. They would let him know whenever they had cut walnut with large forks that might have a lot of figure in the crotch and give him the tree tops. This would be anytime of the year, not just when the sap would be down. Still takes a while but considering the locker was free it seems cheaper than some of the other ways mentioned.

I have been useing it to store wood in but as it's getting close to stick gathering time I ought to clear it out and get a new bulb for it.

 

[RPM]

Vance, thanks for obtaining that information (PVC pipe, etc.). Now if we all could just afford the Pentacryl. : )

 

[CAS14]

"Upon reading the article in the AAW Journal, I set out to test the idea. We integrated the process into out turning classes here at Conover Workshops and tried the process on American beech, maple and cherry. While the latter two woods have a favorable radial to tangential shrinkage ratios, beech has one of the worst in North America, so we had a good test control subject.

It's been so long, I apologize if I'm repetitive, but my usual choice for neighborhood walks is named after a musical lyric, "Sum Beech." A neighbor's tree had died, and was being cut down. I left the beech bark on, it is quite hard, and after over four years of regular use I see no cracks or checks. It's a bit heavy, but good for the biceps and good for the occasional aggressive beast. Seems that I did soak it in pentacryl, but the hard, smooth bark doesn't seem very permeable. Off topic, but I do love my beech!

Vance

http://walkingstickforum.com/gallery/album/74-sum-beech/